"Dantooine, they're on Dantooine...."

[TalN]

It was mentioned by name in the films. Thats one point in its favour. It was featured in KoTOR and KoTOR 2. Thats two points in it's favour. It has deep significance to the Jedi Order. That's three points. Now it appears in the web-comic as the setting for a significant part of the story.

Now if I was planning on placing bets for planets to appear in-game, then Dantooine would be on my lsit right behind Tatooine.

What's Dantooine doing in this time period? It's a peaceful republic planet right?

[CypheR]

It didn't seem very peaceful in KOTOR 2

[TalN]

Dantooine is at a critical location on the Outter Rim. During the time of the Jedi Civil War and following it the planet was a critical supply point for ships to land for supplies or drop off cargo for local Republic planets to make collections from. As you can see from the map of the Sith and Republic systems Dantooine appears to be right on the frontline and given that fact it is no doubt hotly contested. The place also has significance to both the Jedi and the Sith because of the ruins of the Enclave, the fact is is a natural source for lightsabre crystals and it has the ruins of the Infinent Empire there which Revan found.

[fodigg]

Where is dantooine located? Can we compare it against that galactic map?

If it's in the rim it'll either be in on the wrong side of the galaxy or under Imperial control.

[TalN]

Right, bear with me here because this map is quite large. You can also find a more detailed map here although the Starwars Insider one comes from an official source while this one is pieced together by some fans with too much free time on their hands.

Ok, so you don't let lost I'll descrive where Dantooine by starting from the Inner core systems on the images. From Coruscant head east in a straight line, you'll see Dathomir marked with a yellow tag. Now look North East and around 3 systems away is Dantooine. On the more detailed map it is found within the Raioballo Sector of the galaxy.

Using the map from the Timeline video it might be possible to pair up known planets with ones on this map, and from there figure out the remaining planets yet to be announced.

[fodigg]

Right, bear with me here because this map is quite large. You can also find a more detailed map here although the Starwars Insider one comes from an official source while this one is pieced together by some fans with too much free time on their hands.

Ok, so you don't let lost I'll descrive where Dantooine by starting from the Inner core systems on the images. From Coruscant head east in a straight line, you'll see Dathomir marked with a yellow tag. Now look North East and around 3 systems away is Dantooine. On the more detailed map it is found within the Raioballo Sector of the galaxy.

Using the map from the Timeline video it might be possible to pair up known planets with ones on this map, and from there figure out the remaining planets yet to be announced.

Yeah, if Dantooine is in, it's under Imperial control. I say that from looking at the lines drawn in the timeline video compared to the orientation of the "rimma trade route".

[TalN]

OK, you're going to LOVE this. It does seems that there are clear indications between the map shown in the timeline video and the actual galactic map for starwars. Here is the map as it appears in the video.



And now... using the aforementioned maps I've started trying to work out which markers are which planets from the official announced list. Plus! I've found ones which have been hinted at through rumors and some famous planets which have ties to the films.



Now Tython was a tough one at first. The reason for that is that it is a largely unknown planet and never really explored in the EU. All the information says about its location is that it is deep within the Inner Core. At first I mistok Tython for Coruscant but there was a mismatch between its positioning and distance from Alderaan. Now Alderaan itself has been hinted at and rumors are circulating about it, oddly enough the marker appearences EXACTLY where the planet is supposed to be. Korriban was easy to pin point, that sector of space is pretty much devoid of anywhere else. Nal Hutta had me guessing because it is around half way between two arms of the galaxy. At first I was wondering what that world which was west of Nal Hutta was and deep to the south. Then I looked at the maps and it was clear... it's Tatooine! Now as I have said before. To have a starwars game without Tatooine is really unlikely. It is a signiture world and environment for the films and appears in almost every starwars game itself. So I don't expect TOR to be any different.

(updated)
For now, at least, these are my best guesses at what those markers are for what planets. The stuff on the very edges of the galaxy arms are completely off the maps I have so I suspect they may be new worlds that Bioware is creating. Especially as there seems to be one for each faction.

There is some confusion over what planets are on the far edge of Sith space. The two maps I have disagree on the position of planets in that region relative to others which make sense. It's almost as if those worlds are largely unexplored in the fiction so any solid information is limited. Dantooine is clear as day but that far northern world MIGHT be Zonama Sekot which has quite a large role in the EU novels and in the Clone Wars. Being a 'living world' it also stands out as being very unique, it is also a complete jungle world with primative force sensitive tribes. Raxus seems the most likely world in its region, everything else there is largely unknown but it is a busy region so I won't hold my breath if thats wrong. Mon Calamari is almost certain in my mind, the position is exactly right and it is a film famously referenced in the films and EU although not really explored much visually. Kind of like Tython. The Mon Cals are also famous for sticking with the Republic.

Malastare or Naboo? Hard to tell. The positions on the maps disagree in that distance and position from Nal Hutta and Tatooine while their close proximaty means it's a good 50/50 chance. There isn't really much else of significance in the region but I'd wager they'll have Naboo since it is well known from the films compared to Malastare.

Ilum? Well this is the tough one. That marker is in the unknown regions. Yes, thats the place where Revan went exploring and where the Sith appeared to come from. Illum is a famous Jedi world where they send Padawan's to get their first crystal for their lightsabres. It is part of the trials. The world is also known as Adega but once again that region is pretty desolate so I would be surprized if that marker is anything else.

Tal - Ilum is actually mentioned on the official web-page...

"From the frozen wastes of Ilum to the desert plains of Dathomir"

This map may help actually shows the location of Tython...http://images.darkhorse.com/darkhorse/d ... map_lg.jpg

[TalN]

It also mentions Manaan but none of those markers are anywhere near Dathomir or Manaan. But yes, it is good to see Ilum get a mention so thanks for pointing that out. I didn't notice that originally.

??? = Ilum
Ilum = Dorin (no does not fit) ermm let me see

Perhaps...?

Selvaris

[TalN]

The furthest marker couldn't be Ilum as it is too far out. Ilum is on the same arm as Dantooine but on the inner edge of the spiral. That ??? marker is near of the end of the arm which spirals out from the opposite side of the Deep core region from Alderaan.

[TalN]

Someone on the official forums was disputing the fact that Ord Mantell appears on the Sith side of the border. In an effort to explain this I went looking through the swtor.com website which covers the planets in detail and their history. While I cannot fully explain why Ord Mantell appears on the Sith side of the border what I did notice is that the planetary biographies include a small graphic in the lower right corner which shows where the planet is within the galaxy. The angle of the map has changed from the timeline one but what I am pleased to say is that it fully supports my theory of what markers are what planets. It appears to have moved Korriban further towards the Tingle Arm but not so far as to make it appear to be anything else.

I'll cover this in more detail later when I get home from work.

What did occour to me is that while Ord Mantell is a Republic loyal planet that does not mean it cannot exist within Sith controlled space. Indeed, even during the Jedi Civil war the Republic had planets loyal to them deep within Sith space and Dantooine was critical to get supplies through to them. We know that civil war has broken out on Ord Mantell due to the government there deciding to stay loyal to the Republic. But my question is. Why would so many people object to that choice? And I answer, because the planet is within Sith space. If Ord Mantell was in Republic space there wouldn't be much cause for the general population to stage an uprising since there was no danger to them, but if they were within enemy territory and were risking their lives to stay with the Republic you can get people would rebel to try and get themselves out of a dangerous situation.

[TalN]

Ookkkk, this took some time to put together so I hope you appreciate the effort.
When I went looking for more information on the official SWTOR.com website I noticed that each planetary details page there is a graphic which looks something like this:



Why is this handy? Well they all use the same graphic for the galaxy so when you overlay them and keep the galaxy alligned for each one you end up with markers for all of the announced planets in exact positions from each other according to Bioware.

Here is what they look like combined.



A bit rough around the edges I know, but you can see where the markers are pointing at least. Given this information was directly from Bioware, just like the timeline map, it made sense that it was the most accurate point of reference to base theories from since both maps come from the same source. The difference is that, as you can see, this is a top-down viewpoint with a slight angle but with a clear north, south, east, west devide. Ord Mantell is shown north-north-west of Tython while Nal Hutta is to the far East. Therefore I added some compass lines to this image in order to clarify the timeline map one.



As you can see, there is a match between some of the markers and the positions of the planets in their biographical maps. What did grab my attention is that Bioware have Korriban just inside the Tingle Arm part of the galaxy but at the furthest edge of the map. But if you look at this other map someone refered me to will find that it says Korriban should not be in that direction at all. Since this map is also seen from the top-down view it is one of the best ones to use as a point of reference when comparing it with the biography maps.

In either case it means that I need to revise the map I made to allow for Korriban being further out than I had it currently listed. I suppose it is to be expected that there will be some discrepancies between maps from different sources but with these compass lines it is possible to get a better idea of what each of those markets in the timeline video are. What is pleasing is that it does confirm that Nal Hutta and Tython were correctly labeled. However it means that Ord Mantell is actually deeper inside Sith space than I originally had labeled.

[TalN]

While trying to figure out how Korriban ended up so close to what seemed to be the outter rim I had a thought. What if the developers galaxy spiral was not the entire starwars galaxy but is simply the inner, most populated areas? So with some cropping of the aforementioned map and rotating it 15 degrees to the left I found that markers on the timeline map still pair up correctly but Korriban is now nearer to where it is displayed in the biography pages. It is still a little off but it would explain alot plus with the focus on the inner areas it brought in the potential for planets which previously I had considered completely off the map. Here is the cropped and rotated galactic map.

With the cropping applied it instantly removes many of the outter rim planets from the equasion. While I notice that the inner core is no longer dead centre it did correct for Ilum being further out on the opposite side of the galaxy as well. It was almost as if you had zoomed in upon the inner and mid region sectors of the galaxy.



Nal hutta was the clue, with it being due east from the core it indicated that this particular map needed to be rotated for it to fit, this also corrected for Ord Mantell being slightly off north from the Inner core. With the furthermost western marker now being Ilum that left the question of what lies between Ilum and Tython. There wasn't many places of significance and then I noticed that Dorin would be in roughly the right place. Considering that the Kel Dor feature in TOR itself as a highly likely player race it seemed to make sense that they'd get some exposure with their homeworld making an appearence. It is also the home of he Baran Do cult which was an force-sensitive order predating the Jedi Order itself.

Much to the delight of some people the movement of Korriban to the edge of the timeline map allows for some interesting potential. Yavin and Dathomir are now both in the right place to make an appearence, fans of the fish people may not like that Mon Calamari is now completely off the map but many Jedi fans will be pleased that Ossus is now in just the right spot for that marker. Personally I think that having Tython and Ossus and Ilum is overkill but I can't see any other planets fitting this current arrangements.

The world directly north from Alderaan is quite a gamble for me. Nothing really stood out as hsaving any significance except for Arkania which has a long history with the Sith. Bogden did spring to mind but that world is almost devoid of life although it did become the home of he Bando Gora cult, but not until just prior to the Clone Wars.

Lastly we have the marker north of Dathomir but east of Dantooine. Not much there to be honest although what did grab my attention was Serenno which is the homeworld of Count Dooku. The planet also has loose ties to the Sith.

So that is my newest version of the map, until I stumble across something else which forces me to revise things. lol

Great work Tal - Yes I was aware of the "perspective issue" and that top down map you have listed....

It does now make the ref I posted regarding Ilum and Dothomir very compelling..........

I have a spanner to throw into the works - Nal Hutta is actually Neutral....and Ord Mentall is Republic (yes I know you know) just for other readers benefit....interesting selection.

I think we really need at least 2 more planets to be brought to our attention before we can set the alignment and make a good guess (yes I know you know that too LOL).

Great stuff I like the use of the Bioware pic overlay - neat
Matt

[TalN]

Not really a spanner since we don't know what the red and blue line represents. It suggests that there is a frontline so I think it basically represents territorial control over the space ways rather than the alliegence of the planets themselves. Bearing in mind that Ord Mantell has been suggested as the starting world for the bounty hunters judging from the description and interviews, so why would a Sith class be starting on a Republic world? Hutta might be neutral however we heard in the last timeline video about 'unsavoury allies' which I suspect is the Hutts.

Now I don't mind suggestions that Nal Hutta is in the wrong place as long as you can suggest an alternative that makes sense. I mean if Bioware's own biographic page says it is east of the core then it can't really be anywhere else. And there isn't any marker which exists in neutral space, it is either one side or the other.

As for what we need to firm up this theory. I would say we only need to know the location and existance of one more planet to really confirm or deny the general placing of this map. The issue is that we have 4 known worlds (korriban, ord mantell, hutta and tython) but what we really need is a third planet from either side of the border to really triangulate their positions. Key planets which would be really helpful would be either Dantooine or Tatooine since they are outter markers for this galactic map, from there we can exclude everything beyond their distance and look inwards towards planets nearer the core. If they reveal Alderaan next I'm gonna be pissed because that one is obvious! lol

Seems you put a lot of work into the map aligning TaIN, but I do have to disagree with a few of your judgements, first Ord Mantell has to be republic and I would place it on the marker just above Tython. I think that the timeline map is on far less of a tilt and that the location of Nal Hutta should either be where you localize Ossus to be, or Yavin. I should really do my own picture of this set up, I guess I'll get on that; but, for now I'll just try and comment on your interpretation (just speculation....you know it makes a spec out of you and some guy named lation). Upon comparing to the 'official' SW galaxy map, I think korriban would be placed closer to Serenino. Dantooine --> Telos, Ord Mantell either Yavin or maybe Dantooine (not as likely in my mind), Arkania --> Myrkr, I think Alderaan and Tython are pretty accurate. Nal Hutta --> Ryloth/Tatooine, Tatooine/Genosis --> maybe Naboo, Zhar/Lok/other planets in the area. I think where you put Korriban, Tund would fit nicely, Dathomir --> Ossus/Gala, I think the Onderon/Kashyyk is a good guess, Ilum is probably right too, but I wouldn't rule out Rakata prime. The south of the core isn't quite clear, I'd have to dig deeper into which planets in that area might make the most sense to be in the game. But yeah, this is just my opinion on the matter.

[TalN]

I have entertained and checked the position of Ord Mantell several times. This is why I drew the compass lines on the map because it is the definitive way to settle the whole issue of Ord Mantell's position. Now I can rationalise why it makes sense for Ord Mantell until I'm blue in the face but some people won't listen to reason, so in that situation I fall back to basics. Ord Mantell, on every single galactic map, has to be somewhere north of the core worlds. Now if Dantooine is a world which appears in the game, and assuming from the web-comic it is, then it is possible to draw a line from Tython to Dantooine and somewhere along that line it passes near to Ord Mantell.

Now I might be slamming my head against a brick wall here but I think it is only fair to fully evaluate someone elses opinion when it differs from my own. I never assume people are idiots, there is always a reason why someone forms an opinion and the goal of any discussion which involves trying to bring someone around to seeing and agreeing with another perspective is addressing the root of that opinion.

Since this image...

... comes from Bioware just like the timeline map we will first plot out the known planets so we have a frame of reference.



Now that places all the worlds in the right place according to the compass. First, lets add the compass to a galactic map. Much like I did with my map I've made the compass fit the planetary position from the composite I first mentioned rather than drawing a line through the middle of the galaxy.

You can find the link to that image here.

With these new lines drawn you do have clear benefits, Manaan now appears in the position of one of the markers east of Aderaan. But in the process you lose Dathomir from my theory map.



There are clear benefits from spinning the directions around so that Ord Mantell is in Republic space. However in order to do this you need to remove Ilum and replace it with Kalee which was general grevious' homeworld. The reason for this is that Ilum is due west from Ord Mantell but the marker is clearly north-west. Therefore the only planet of any significance there is Kalee. Korriban has to be the furthest marker from the east compass line. Nal hutta needs to be due south of Korriban in the south-eastern region. The line from Nal Hutta to Alderaan passes by only one significant planet, Manaan. But the problem with this is that the planet is completely covered with water and in the prologue for TOR it says that the Selkath have retreated under the ocean. Most of the problems then occour when dealing with this south-eastern region. Kamino is in the right place but it seems odd that yet another water world is included, but it is at least a famous planet. This marker might also be the Bothan homeworld. The marker further out from that Kamino/Bothowui marker could be a number of obscure worlds, the only one with any Sith/Imperial connections is Pzob.

On the Republic side of the border we have some encouraging possibilities. Mustafar is in the right place, Utapu is and the marker for Tatooine/Geonosis is still present. Then we come to the south-western region... Phu. Yes, Phu. And trust me on this, it couldn't be anything else. On the galactic map that area is almost completely devoid of any worlds and the only one which is around half way up from Geonosis and the inner core is Phu. The planet is largely unknown and only gets a passing mention in the Boba Fett novels. The planet was also included in the first draft of the Phantom Menace so it was planned to be in the films at one point.

Is this map possible? Of course it is. There isn't any glaring inconsistancies in the markers from known planets but what it does remove is a number of worlds which have been loudly hinted at by Bioware. Ilum and Dathomir are mentioned by name in the history prologue along with the mention of Selkath retreating underwater. The web-comic also suggests Dantooine will be in-game but it would be impossible to get Dantooine onto this map because it needs to be directly north of Ord Mantell along the northern compass line.

The theory that Ord Mantell is within Republic space is certainly rooted within a solid theory. It does allow for a number of planets which are famous but I personally feel it excludes more than it contributes. I suppose we'll have to wait to see what the next couple official worlds will be.

Thoughts on the Planets according to your latest map:

• Kalee is a possible planet as given by the hint of Kaleesh avatars.
  
• Geonosis might be used as well. Aren't there geonosian avatars on the TOR forums? Tatooine could be included instead just because, but I doubt it.
  
• Manaan is a possibility as a source of Kolto (makes a great contested battleground)
  
• Bothuwai was mentioned as belonging to the Sith territories as part of the Treaty of Coruscant.
  
• Onderon would make sense to be included as the resting place of Freedon Nadd.
  
• Mandalore makes more sense than Yavin. Yavin is mostly undisturbed between Exar Kun's time and the Alliance's occupation of it 3000 years later.

And far as the comics, it was stated not all planets or npcs in the comic will be in the game.


EDIT: Onderon and/ or Mandalore being included in the game would make sense for the Mandolorians to side with the Sith Empire.